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hottm8oh
USA
141 Posts |
 Posted - 06/10/2008 : 08:02:09
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I've tried to explain TMS to some people--my bosses, my in-laws, husband, friends, and most of them don't get it. My bosses both looked at me like I was crazy when I told them my pain was psychosomatic. When I told my husband I was having a back pain flare-up last week, he said, "You're at home and you're safe. You have nothing to be stressed out about." I told my sister-in-law about TMS last night, and she told me I just have to "forgive my mother." I was in school last year, but I stopped going because of my pain. I ran into someone I hadn't seen in awhile who asked me how school was going. I told her I dropped out due to health reasons and started to tell her about TMS. She was polite to me, but I could tell she wasn't sold on the theory.
I know I'm not going to be able to explain TMS to people in a few sentences, which is probably primarily why they don't get it, but I'm wondering if I should stop telling people about it completely. Everyone knows I've had back pain and stomach problems for years, and sometimes I'm asked how I feel. I want to tell them the truth, but I don't want people thinking I'm batsh*t insane. I also don't want to have to lie or be evasive and have that be a hindrance to my recovery.
Do you talk about TMS to other people or do you avoid the topic? Do you find that it helps you or hurts you to discuss it with others, or does it make no difference in your pain levels? |
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mk6283
USA
272 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2008 : 08:29:23
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Great question. I think that if you are still having doubts YOURSELF about whether or not you have TMS or whether or not you fully believe in the TMS diagnosis, then I'd probably say to carry on with your TMS work and don't attempt to bring it up to others unless you are asked because their likely skepticism may rub off on you.
However, if you are already completely convinced and/or you have already had success with the approach to the point where others can't really influence you, then you should DEFINITELY try and get the word out as much as you can. It's going to take a lot of work by all of us to change the current paradigm.
On a personal note, I try to bring TMS up as often as I can, but only to those who seem to be open-minded enough to listen. However, I consider my knowledge of TMS to be an enormous asset to me (it explains SO MUCH in medicine that most doctors really don't have the first clue about) and I feel privileged to have experienced it myself regardless of what others might think of it for the time being. Take care.
Best,
MK |
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2008 : 08:33:57
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How about "I'm better, thanks." I used to say: I have learned that much physical pain is due to stress or other emotions and I've learned to work things out better. Think of when you are nervous: your heart pounds--that's a physical reaction to an emotion.
Though mind/body is getting more coverage, it still is a different way of thinking and there's a lot to learn.
There was a newspiece yesterday that with the economy the way it is, more doctors visits are being recorded than in the past. stress causes illness.
When I first recovered I did go into more detail but found people zoned out. It is so different than what they're used to hearing. One person told me "oh you got lots of rest; that's why you're better." She still has pain. I don't.
I also found that one or two sentence answers were sufficient. You could give more if someone was truly interested. |
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southpaw
Canada
29 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2008 : 07:13:30
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It can be difficult to explain TMS to others that's for sure. I pick my people and have found that it helps. My husband and kids are pretty receptive to the idea and can see it working with me. I have found that when I talk out load with someone who is open to listening, my pain has gone from an 8 to a 2 in a matter of minutes. That has helped me convince my brain of TMS.(I don't have a TMS doctor or know anyone personally who knows about TMS)
I've written about this before but one time as I "talked out loud" to my husband asking "why does it cause me so much pain to stand for long periods when everyone else, even 80 year olds do not have a problem with standing, it doesn't make sense" my back pain just disappeared. Then I knew I was on to something.
I'm not completely healed yet, I have ten years of conditioning to get over, but I'm on my way. |
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campbell28
80 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2008 : 08:15:03
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I've found the easiest way to explain it is to tell people (those I don't want to go into detail with) that I realised my problems were stress-related and that I'm fine now.
The trouble with talking about TMS is that it is quite a complex subject, it involves emotions etc and its quite difficult to really get the essence of it across to someone in a casual conversation. If I don't feel comfortable with the person, or I can tell they're not receptive, I tend to find myself getting tied up in knots trying to explain it, and then it sounds like a load of nonsense. So I'll just start off with 'it was caused by stress' and if the person seems to relate to that I may explain more.
I think part of the problem is that when you accept TMS theory, and have benefited from it, it seems like such a marvellous, miraculous thing that you want to tell everyone about it (and you also want to stop talking about the physical symptoms).
But the trouble is, lots of people dont' want to hear it. It's like when someone becomes a born-again Christian or stops smoking: they feel fantastic and they want to tell you all about it, and how you could feel fantastic too if you did the same, and you just want to bang their heads against a wall.
I realised this only after being a bit evangelical about TMS: in particalur to a friend of mine who I am 100 per cent sure also has it. She doesn't want to know, and I was actually pushing her away the more I talked about it. I think if that happened again now, I would just say, 'why don't you read this book' and leave it at that. You can't make people believe it; or even if they do accept it, they may still be absolutely resistant to seeing it in themselves. |
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Stryder
686 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2008 : 08:16:37
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Your heart is in the right place but Jane Q. Public at large is still brainwashed by the medical / industrial complex. Is nobody's fault, that just reality at the moment. The population is slowly opening their minds, but they have a set notion of how pain works, and TMS theory is still contrary to the mainstream.
But this doesnt mean you should say nothing.
I agree with the responses so far, keep your reply short, simple, and not very specific. I usually say something like, "My back is fine. The muscle pain is now gone."
In some cases when I have talked with someone and get to know their (TMS) "personality type", I will loan them my copy of HBP, and simply say, "You can read this if you want, it helped me.", and leave it at that. About 50% of the time, they dont even crack the cover.
You could optionally send people to the 20/20 video link (in the forum posts multiple times) and let them get a glimse of the Good Doctor.
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20/20 segment:
http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3679&SearchTerms=20/20
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Posted - 06/06/2008 : 12:43:20
Here's a direct link to Dr. Hadler speaking on surgery for lower back pain. Conclusion: No benefits, and possible side effects.
http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=3300351
broadband connection probably needed.
Ralph
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Most important, do not get discouraged in any way. If you solve your pain then you WIN! Try not to judge yourself based on the minds of others.
Take care, -Stryder |
Edited by - Stryder on 06/11/2008 08:52:33 |
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hottm8oh
USA
141 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2008 : 08:22:15
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| I'm glad I posted this. Someone put doubts in my head today and I needed to read this thread to reassure myself that I was on the right track. I vow to not mention it to people again until I'm further along in the recovery process. |
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JohnD
USA
371 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2008 : 09:15:18
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Generally speaking, it is very hard for others to accept "new" information such as TMS theory.
Have some compassion for them as its not easy to embrace new information like this especially in the world we live in where people are always trying to shove in
I think its important to be TMS role models more than anything. There are certain people to talk to about it and others where frankly it just isn't worth the time, or energy.
The best part about it is that you can choose who you tell and who you don't, and how much you want to tell and how much to withhold.
Its also a great way to improve communication skills. Instead of using words like "psychosomatic" which could sound taboo, you can talk about stress and use other words that people can relate to. This makes a big difference in how they receive what you're saying, and how you feel about the interaction with them. |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2008 : 09:32:01
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quote:
Originally posted by hottm8oh
... I vow to not mention it to people again until I'm further along in the recovery process.
I believe this is a good idea. Beware of the hidden motivations for trying to convince others about TMS. I think you have to convince yourself first. |
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Wavy Soul
USA
779 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2008 : 10:20:13
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Dave - would you say more about the hidden motivations my in your experience.
Love is the answer, whatever the question |
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hottm8oh
USA
141 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2008 : 10:24:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave
quote:
Originally posted by hottm8oh
... I vow to not mention it to people again until I'm further along in the recovery process.
I believe this is a good idea. Beware of the hidden motivations for trying to convince others about TMS. I think you have to convince yourself first.
I hear you. I would say I'm 90% convinced, but there are some things that still bug me. I can still feel some fight going on in my brain. Some of it is silly "but my spine is out of alignment" talk  and some of it is that I don't fully understand TMS just yet. (I'm about halfway through Divided Mind, so I'm hoping I'll get there soon.) I do think on some level I have talked about it to try and further convince MYSELF of TMS. If I could get others to believe it, then I wouldn't have any naysayers holding me back. I had someone--another bad back pain sufferer--doubt me today and it made me nervous. It was a minor setback, but a setback nonetheless. |
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pandamonium
United Kingdom
202 Posts |
Posted - 06/12/2008 : 06:48:47
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I agree with the others I'd not tell anyone except my husband and a close friend if I thought they were open to the idea.
My sister and I have been talking about TMS a fair bit recently and she's not convinced, she prefers to believe that I have something structural wrong with my back but that fear and conditioning can make it flare up...Still she hasn't read the books I have and since she's not a "pleaser" she wouldn't have a clue what I was on about if I tried to explain it to her further.
Of course the one person I'd never tell is my mother, she'd roll her eyes and tell me in a partonising tone "yes, well I always suspected it was all in your head".
If anyone asks about my back, I say I'm showing some improvement and am hopeful of a full recovery at some point, and if pushed further I say I'm trying a new sort of therapy but the thing is, people don't ask what - they don't want all the details they just want to know you are ok. I suppose it's like being a new mom and telling all and sundry about the joys of motherhood, unless you're a mom you just smile and think "yeah, whatever..."
P |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 06/12/2008 : 10:16:56
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quote:
Originally posted by hottm8oh
I do think on some level I have talked about it to try and further convince MYSELF of TMS. If I could get others to believe it, then I wouldn't have any naysayers holding me back. I had someone--another bad back pain sufferer--doubt me today and it made me nervous. It was a minor setback, but a setback nonetheless.
That's exactly my point. When trying to convince others, you may actually just be trying to convince yourself. At this stage, keeping the doubt out of your mind is important. You need to read and re-read the book until you accept that pain is not caused by our spines going out of alignment. (For me, that was especially tough, since I was a regular visitor to a chiropractor for 15 years.)
I would suggest that you read Healing Back Pain since it is a bit more down to earth than Sarno's more recent books. The Mindbody Connection expands on those ideas and would be my next choice. The Divided Mind seems a bit more cerebral to me, and may not be as effective in the early stages of TMS treatment. I also enjoyed Dr. Sopher's book which is an easier read. |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 06/12/2008 : 13:39:01
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When other people don't get it, I recommend not talking to them about it. Don't engage them. You will likely only get frustrated and disappointed.
I only told a few people: family members (but this doesn't work for everyone) and some close friends. Some of the friends are fine with believing it works for me but can't imagine it could apply to them even though they have similar (though less serious) problems. It's helped my mom but she still doesn't properly believe the whole theory, and she isn't completely recovered. I have in some cases tried the "I have this book you should read" approach, which saves me from arguing with them, but only after I didn't need the book anymore.
Everyone else gets the "My hands are totally fine now, thanks for asking" response. Their response is usually to say "Glad to hear it" and change the subject. That's exactly what I'm usually aiming for.
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It's not 100% belief that's required, but 100% commitment. |
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la_kevin
USA
351 Posts |
Posted - 06/13/2008 : 05:25:12
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I used to explain to people what I had(TMS). Now I just say, "I have a chronic pain disorder sort of like Fibromyalgia". That seems to settle it in their heads.
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"Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans"- John Lennon |
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penguins
39 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2008 : 05:44:08
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Hi there, about a month in to my TMS work I was doing so much better with my neck/uuper back pain. I went in for a second visit with a new psychiatrist who was prescribing my anti-depressant. I was excited to tell him of my improvements since I hadn't seen him since I started the work. Well, to my dismay he said, "Well, that's great, but we'll see if the pain comes back." I left there deflated and, of course, feeling more pain. The pain continued for a while until finally I recognized the anger I felt towards him and let it go. In my mind, he being a psychiatrist should have made him totally "get" this. I was so upset that he couldn't see how miraculous this was. Looking back now on it, I recognize that unless he'd had experience with TMS, he probably wouldn't be so open to it. However, I chose not to see him anymore because I didin't want to have any more of those remarks said to me.
I've found that there are some people who I can explain this stuff to, but for the most part, I just say a quick, "I'm doing so much better now" type of thing. My own husband who saw the process of me becoming pain free right before his eyes believes it works for me, but will probably never be able to apply it to himself despite his chronic back pain. Same with my father unfortuantely. I sent him all of Dr. Sarno's books to no avail.
It is truly frustrating when you so want the world to know about this because it can help people who are suffering and having unnecessary surgeries, etc. All we can do is keep on believing and hope that someday the mindset will shift.
Take care.
--Jennifer :) |
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Peg
USA
284 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2008 : 14:40:10
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I have had similar experiences trying to explain my recovery and trying to spread the word as it were. I agree that a brief response works best with people who don't appear interested. It is not a good way to convince ourselves. A better way is to connect the dots. Remind ourselves how we are described in Dr. Sarnos' books. Remember how our pain would follow the patterns described by Dr. Sarno. Remind ourselves how our pain has lessened just by learning this information. Take notice of how activity sometimes improves our symptoms. Re-affirm to ourselves that nothing major has been found in our testing and that we are healthy and strong.
[quote by penguins: It is truly frustrating when you so want the world to know about this because it can help people who are suffering and having unnecessary surgeries, etc. All we can do is keep on believing and hope that someday the mindset will shift.)
Is this really all we can do? Are we supposed to wait for "the mindset" to magically shift?
I understand that studies published in peer reviewed journals will be necessary to encourage main stream medicine to take a closer look at this information. Hopefully between the Seligman Medical Institute and Dr. Schubiner's efforts, studies will be taking place.
However, isn't there something else that can be done?
What if the tens of thousands of people who have been helped by Dr. Sarno's work, all wrote letters describing their amazing recoveries and sent them to the same place at around the same time? (I know we would have to get the word out somehow) I'm not exactly sure where the letters would need to go to be the most effective, but I have some ideas and am open to suggestions.
Some of my ideas would be: (in no particular order)
1. The National Institutes of Health
2. The American Medical Association
3. The Surgeon General
4. The Secretary for Public Health
5. Physicians For Responsible Medicine
6. The Agency for Healthcare Research and Quality (AHRQ)
7. The Centers for Disease Control
8. United Sates Congress
Sometimes it take a grassroots movement to help create a shift.
Any thoughts?
Take Care
Peg
In questions of science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of a single individual. Galileo Galilei |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2008 : 22:22:38
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There have been many news segments on Dr. Sarno including some of the big programs like 20/20. Every time, some people are helped, but many will react just as we find people in our own lives reacting.
If people do not want to get it, they will not. Paradigm shifts rarely happen overnight. We all have to judge for ourselves when it's wise or helpful to get into it the issue and when it's not.
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It's not 100% belief that's required, but 100% commitment. |
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la_kevin
USA
351 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2008 : 23:52:01
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It's weird. When I first heard of Mind Body/ TMS theories, I never had a moment of "Aw that sounds like crap". I totally thought it was a STRONG possibility. And when I first heard Sarno, I thought, "Duhhh, after all my medical 'treatments' this is the one thing I didn't really think of."
But some people are seriously so closed to outside the box thinking that they don't even ponder anything like that.
I usually just ignore people like that. If I have to explain something to a person like they're a 5 year old, I just make some easier answer up and forget it.
More "thinking" people actually get it though. They actually are curious about the syndrome and they usually say "Oh yeah that makes sense, I've experienced things like that too".
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"Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans"- John Lennon |
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What to do when other people don't get it
