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stevep
106 Posts |
 Posted - 07/08/2012 : 20:50:53
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| Pretty simple topic, and I'm sure there have been threads on it before. But I am really struggling with it at the moment. Particularly in the early mornings when i wake up with leg pain that won't allow me to finish my sleep schedule. I think it may help myself and others to hear some of your "go to" ways of ignoring the pain. Because that is a big part of slaying the beast IMO. |
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balto
839 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 05:48:41
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Hi Steve, I have tried for years and never was able to ignore any of the symptoms I had, no matter how hard I tried. I don't think we can ever be able to do that. It is there all the time and it hurt like hell, how can you ignore it? Also, the very act of trying to ignore created lots of stress and disappointment when we are unable to ignore.
What really helped me is peaceful acceptance. I am just being an observer and observe my symptoms. I acknowledge that the symptoms will be with me for awhile until my emotion calm down and my mind is at peace. I accept that the symptoms is there because of my emotional state and it will leave when my mind is back in balance and peace. Then I start to shift my thinking to something else.
every time the thought about my pain came back into my mind, I just repeat the whole thought process above and focus on thinking, doing something else.
Your mind got stuck in a endless fear loop (fear -> symptoms -> fear -> symptoms -> fear...) what we need to do is to get out of that loop. You're still in pain even when whatever event started the pain no longer exist (lost of job, divorce..., got new job, remarried) because now your fear of your symptoms is the new cause of the symptoms.
Dr Sarno's distraction theory said the symptoms is there to distract us from some unpleasant emotion. To distract us, it need to have our attention. To have our attention, it need to create "fear". If somehow you can remove that "fear", you will break out of that fear loop and free yourself from pain.
I hope you will feel better soon.
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No, I don't know everything. I'm just here to share my experience. |
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stevep
106 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 10:44:00
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| Acceptance. This may be a key notion that I'm over looking. Thanks for the reply. |
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pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 14:08:31
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| This makes a lot of sense to me as a matter of theory, but in practice when pain gets really severe, even if it's "only" muscle pain and not a gunshot wound, for me anyhow it is essentially impossible to ignore or accept it. |
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SteveO
USA
272 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 14:55:35
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I don't know where the idea of ignore the pain came from? The brain's purpose is to create something you cannot ignore, and so you cannot ignore it.
What I mean by "ignore it" is to not worry about it. Don't panic, don't run to the hospital, don't get your underwear all tied up with fear. There's no way you will be able to not pay attention to it. I healed by not paying attention to how I was healing, ceasing the day to day body check-ups. That's what I meant by don't pay at-tension.
So ignore it to me, means, saying to yourself, "Ok. you're there, I understand what you're doing to me brain, and I understand why you're doing it to me, to hold my attention...now I won't fear you, and I won't allow you to alter my daily plans...and I won't obsess on you...I will move and live as I please...I will try to understand why you have decided to try to distract me...I will try to lower my tension level...I will do the work necessary so that you don't have to thump me like you're doing...I will be rid of the pain because I know why it exists, and I will take action to resolve the pain by whatever means necessary...I will be free again because I want to be."
Steve |
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stevep
106 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 15:09:20
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Ok I gotcha. I should have asked about "not paying attention" as opposed to "ignore". I see the difference now.
I've got a bunch of your posts on this forum saved to the notes section on my phone, SteveO. I try and refer to them often. This one is going there as well. You should write a book...............oh wait  |
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 15:27:52
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Balto's right on the job, as usual. Peaceful acceptance to the extent possible. Symptoms need fear like plants need sunlight. Rob them of their sustenance and they soon wither and die..It's really quite remarkable, how quickly this often happens.
But don't take a stop watch to your pain. We're all different, and "trying" to make symptoms go away is counterproductive.
Peaceful acceptance. Balto's got it right. |
Edited by - art on 07/09/2012 15:28:37 |
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stevep
106 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 16:03:49
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| I agree. It's just easier said than done I suppose. That's like saying I should peacefully accept this little fiery demon from hell that happens to be living in my body and gnawing away at my sciatic nerve on a continuous basis... |
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pspa123
672 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 16:34:19
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| Stevep, I am right there with you. I think I understand the approach, but when the neck pain is excruciating, I don't know how to detach enough to observe or accept it, if feels like it IS me. |
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SteveO
USA
272 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 17:15:05
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Yeah Steve, that's probably the better question, don't pay attention vs. ignore. It's a fine line though isn't it?
One thing I tried not to do early on was break everything down into semantics. But there wasn't very much information back when I was healing. Mindbody Prescription just came out as I was ending my healing, Fred Amir had come out with his book Rapid Recovery, and The Divided Mind wasn't born yet. With more and more information available there comes the added potential for confusion.
So how do you not pay attention? There are many little ideas and behavioral tricks that I laid out in my book that I did. Each one intended to break that damn focus. The entire array of things I did is the essence of the book. My intention in writing was to show people that they can heal because I was in such bad health and I did it. And to show the mistakes I made the setbacks I had, the things I tried and the things that worked. I used my imagination.
Physically, it's trying to unhinge nerve cell identity. Philosophically it's trying to begin a new life. Spiritually it's an awakening.
Everyone once in a while someone asks me about this or that and I tell them what I did to not think about my pain. Maybe I should start a new thread of tricks for not paying attention. SteveP is right, "it's just easier said than done." The psychiatrists and counselors who are recommending my book tell me they like it because it shows that healing isn't always easy. That people give up too quickly when things don't go as planned. My persistence paid off but I wanted a better life.
But as I've repeated many times, each person heals in their own way. What works for one doesn't necessarily work for another, like yelling at your brain or journaling--these didn't do anything for me but they work for many many people. There's also a fine line of accepting something. This doesn't mean it's now ok to have pain, it's about accepting that the pain is a part of you, created by you for a specific purpose, that instead of fighting against should be understood and not hated and despised. By being angry at your nagging pain everyday you actually play into its hands, unless you're in the yelling at your brain group.
So there is a bad way to accept pain, which is thinking you have to live with it and that it's always going to be there, and then there's the good way of accepting it by trying to understand what the conflict is, to know your brain has done you a massive favor by not giving you a heart attack or something more serious. The pain offers a chance at future peace because it tells you that you don't like where you're at now; so go fix it and be happy.
So words like ignore and acceptance are just words. But their meaning can resonate loudly depending how you interpret them. That's why so many people ask questions, to make sure they fully understand how they should interpret something before they implement or take action. No one wants to do the wrong thing, first because they're perfectionists, and second they don't want to prolong the pain or get worse.
So words matter because they are the precursor to action, and action is the precursor to change and change is needed to heal. So it was a great question Steve. It needed to be asked. But don't get too bogged down standing on the "acquiring information" pillar, once you get the gist, jump to the next pillar which is "action." But not until you're confident and ready. Keep asking, keep gathering, up until you're ready...
Steve |
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balto
839 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 17:24:00
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quote:
Originally posted by stevep
I agree. It's just easier said than done I suppose. That's like saying I should peacefully accept this little fiery demon from hell that happens to be living in my body and gnawing away at my sciatic nerve on a continuous basis...
We don't have much choices Steve. Maybe it would help if you can think of your pain as if it is a broken leg you got from an accident. It hurt like hell but what can you do about it? You have to wait for it to heal and while waiting you're still go on with life as if everything is normal, except that you are now walking with a clutch.
Tms pain will heal after sometime when your mind is no longer under stress and when you don't allow it to scare you anymore. Angry at the pain or feel bad for yourself just make it worse. really, we don't have any other choice but live with it for sometime.
You have to 'believe' that it will get better, the symptoms will cease, and live will be back to normal.
Tms is just some negative events created some unpleasant emotions that produce some initial pain or anxiety symptoms. The fear of the symptoms keep the symptoms alive. Now, to eliminate it we have to go in reverse. Remove the fear of the symptoms. Tell your fear you are nothing but negative thoughts, you will have to leave soon. Then focus on making your life more peaceful, more positive, more at peace. Forgive, forget, and move on.
You have to believe. Belief is a very powerful force we have against tms/anxiety.
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No, I don't know everything. I'm just here to share my experience. |
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stevep
106 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 17:46:00
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Excellent advice my friend, thanks. Getting angry at the pain and feeling bad about myself seem to be major hurdles. That and conditioning. Conditioning tends to take a bad hold on me as well.
I need to stop being afraid, you are absolutely correct... |
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RageSootheRatio
Canada
430 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 18:09:50
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GREAT discussion, everybody! THANKS!
PSPA123, in cases of acute pain, sometimes I think it is a reasonable course of action to take meds, (and for myself, I find anything with codeine is nice.) 
Seriously, I always recall this post by Fredarm57 from WAY back in 2005:
quote:
"Sometimes all you can do is ride out a pain episode. I saw Dr. Sarno in the early 1990's. During one of his lectures, someone asked him what to do when you had a severe pain attack. He replied, with a twinkle in his eye, "go to bed with a good book and a bottle of wine". Like Sandy says--don't expect it to last. Also, you might ask your doctor for a prescription for Klonopin or one of its equivalents. It will help to relax you. It's not a long-term solution--over time it's addicting--but it can be very useful to help with a severe pain attack in the short term. I had an episode in February, took some for a couple of weeks, and along with some therapy and "doing the work", I am now fine."
hope this helps, RSR
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stevep
106 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 18:21:20
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quote:
Originally posted by SteveO
Yeah Steve, that's probably the better question, don't pay attention vs. ignore. It's a fine line though isn't it?
One thing I tried not to do early on was break everything down into semantics. But there wasn't very much information back when I was healing. Mindbody Prescription just came out as I was ending my healing, Fred Amir had come out with his book Rapid Recovery, and The Divided Mind wasn't born yet. With more and more information available there comes the added potential for confusion.
So how do you not pay attention? There are many little ideas and behavioral tricks that I laid out in my book that I did. Each one intended to break that damn focus. The entire array of things I did is the essence of the book. My intention in writing was to show people that they can heal because I was in such bad health and I did it. And to show the mistakes I made the setbacks I had, the things I tried and the things that worked. I used my imagination.
Physically, it's trying to unhinge nerve cell identity. Philosophically it's trying to begin a new life. Spiritually it's an awakening.
Everyone once in a while someone asks me about this or that and I tell them what I did to not think about my pain. Maybe I should start a new thread of tricks for not paying attention. SteveP is right, "it's just easier said than done." The psychiatrists and counselors who are recommending my book tell me they like it because it shows that healing isn't always easy. That people give up too quickly when things don't go as planned. My persistence paid off but I wanted a better life.
But as I've repeated many times, each person heals in their own way. What works for one doesn't necessarily work for another, like yelling at your brain or journaling--these didn't do anything for me but they work for many many people. There's also a fine line of accepting something. This doesn't mean it's now ok to have pain, it's about accepting that the pain is a part of you, created by you for a specific purpose, that instead of fighting against should be understood and not hated and despised. By being angry at your nagging pain everyday you actually play into its hands, unless you're in the yelling at your brain group.
So there is a bad way to accept pain, which is thinking you have to live with it and that it's always going to be there, and then there's the good way of accepting it by trying to understand what the conflict is, to know your brain has done you a massive favor by not giving you a heart attack or something more serious. The pain offers a chance at future peace because it tells you that you don't like where you're at now; so go fix it and be happy.
So words like ignore and acceptance are just words. But their meaning can resonate loudly depending how you interpret them. That's why so many people ask questions, to make sure they fully understand how they should interpret something before they implement or take action. No one wants to do the wrong thing, first because they're perfectionists, and second they don't want to prolong the pain or get worse.
So words matter because they are the precursor to action, and action is the precursor to change and change is needed to heal. So it was a great question Steve. It needed to be asked. But don't get too bogged down standing on the "acquiring information" pillar, once you get the gist, jump to the next pillar which is "action." But not until you're confident and ready. Keep asking, keep gathering, up until you're ready...
Steve
Not sure how I overlooked this post before. I think it is because I am reading on the phone. Good stuff though, thanks. I'm ready for the next pillar man, I know I am... |
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Wavy Soul
USA
779 Posts |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 23:53:52
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Steveo (btw, is that pronounced like Oreo cookie?)
Thanks for your clear parsing of nuances.
Love is the answer, whatever the question |
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stayfit65
54 Posts |
Posted - 07/11/2012 : 02:53:19
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| I really appreciate all of the advice and personal stories in this post. Balto, I think you should write a book, too!!! You inspire me so much!!! |
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head2toe
United Kingdom
37 Posts |
Posted - 07/11/2012 : 07:09:13
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quote:
Originally posted by SteveO
Maybe I should start a new thread of tricks for not paying attention.
Steve
Yes please, it would be great if you could do that. |
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Your methods of ignoring the pain?
