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marsha
252 Posts |
 Posted - 08/26/2014 : 09:49:51
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Wether TMS is physical or psychological makes very little difference for me at this point. I cannot find any improvement anywhere .
Marsha |
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Dave
USA
1864 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2014 : 10:38:23
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Hi Marsha.
Despite the fact that you have no relief from the symptoms, I still believe you benefit from understanding and accepting them as TMS.
Those who have the extent of symptoms that you do, who are not armed with the knowledge of TMS, are likely to spend much of their time trying to find a physical cure. They will have countless doctor's appointments, MRIs, CTs, physical therapy, and in many cases, multiple surgeries. They will join support groups that serve only to perpetuate the belief that the symptoms have a physical origin. They will seek relief via medicine, which can lead to opioid dependency or use of anti-depressants (the only drugs approved for fibromyalgia and other chronic pain disorders). They may be bed-ridden and unable to perform the most basic physical activities.
I realize you are in constant pain, and I truly sympathize. However, despite the pain, you do manage to live your life as best as you can, and most of all, you do not obsess about finding a physical or medicinal cure. Even though your knowledge and acceptance has not led to relief, you still seem to believe that TMS applies to you. To me, this means you are a very strong willed person. You have not completely given up on the TMS diagnosis despite the fact that it has not led to relief.
For me, acceptance of TMS has not led to total relief either. I will get a flare-up of low back pain from time to time. The difference is, before seeing Dr. Sarno, it would lead to excruciating spasms, several days' of not being able to get out of bed, use of strong painkillers and a series of chiropractic adjustments. Now, I grin and bear the pain and think about the psychological triggers that may be causing it. I no longer fear those debilitating spasms. I accept the pain is benign, and go about my life. It typically fades quickly.
In some respects, your message is absolutely correct. The origin of the pain is not significant. It is how you choose to allow it to affect your life. I wish I had an answer as to why you have not experienced relief. At this stage Dr. Sarno would prescribe a TMS therapist. I am not sure if you have already gone down that route.
I believe that it is possible for chronic TMS pain to continue if the underlying psychological factors cannot be addressed. For example, if someone is under constant stress due to a negative family situation, but has no way to escape that situation, it may never be possible to experience full relief since the underlying emotional ingredients are too powerful. It does not seem as if this applies to you, but maybe there is something going on that you just have never realized or accepted is causing inner conflict.
I wish I had a better answer for you. It took me years before I experienced significant relief from symptoms. Nevertheless I will still get a flare-up now and then, as I believe is the case with many people prone to TMS. Just like someone who quit cigarettes might have an occasional smoke, or someone who lost 100 lbs. will eat an entire chocolate cake during a time of great stress. TMS is a habit that is formed from our childhood. It is always there, lurking, in one way or another, waiting for an opportunity to strike. It is how we react to it that is most important. |
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tennis tom
USA
4746 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2014 : 12:18:57
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| Great response Dave! Marsha, you gave us quite a fright a bit ago, hope Dave's answer helps and you turn the corner. Have you tried a TMS therapist? You can do it by phone or skype. |
Edited by - tennis tom on 08/26/2014 12:20:34 |
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marsha
252 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2014 : 15:11:31
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I am seeing a TMS therapist.
I was a patient of Dr Sarno's in 1999 and again in 2007.
I have suffered with TMS most of my life off and on.
In 1999 it was a two year bout. After seeing Dr.. Sarno's it took about 6 months or so to be pain free.
2007 relapse still going strong.
I have no memory of what it feels like to have no pain.
In desperation I have tried over the counter as well as prescription drugs. They do not work.
Thank you for you replies and well wishes.
Wish a little harder.
It can't hurt, right?
Marsha |
Edited by - marsha on 08/26/2014 15:12:57 |
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tennis tom
USA
4746 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2014 : 16:46:03
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Marsha,
Thanks for the reply, as you see there's a lot of people here rooting for you. I see hope! What would you be doing if you didn't have TMS? |
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marsha
252 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2014 : 17:35:57
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| Living. |
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balto
839 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2014 : 20:42:21
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truly "living" also cure TMS and many other ills.
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No, I don't know much. I'm just here to share my experience. |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 08/27/2014 : 00:09:02
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Marsha,
Glad to see you are still reaching out for help. This is especially important for tough cases. I know cause i've been there.
For my case the only way out was through feeling my repressed feelings. NOTHING else made one iota of difference. I had to discover repressed rage and I had to go where I didn't want to go. I needed a therapist and a setting that was safe enough to do it. I had to change venues and therapists several times to get the right environment for me to do the work that I needed to do.
I needed to do a lot of inner child work. Have you explored this?
Don't give up Marsha. Keep at it and change your therapy if you have to. Don't give up.
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alix
USA
434 Posts |
Posted - 08/27/2014 : 03:15:15
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Marsha,
I also went nowhere with my initial Sarno approach (reading MBP over and over, the 12 reminders, the TMS videos, the TMS audio tapes, the TMS worksheets, the TMS doctor, the TMS psychotherapist). Two years of it. I eventually realized that I was just going from one distraction to the next.
What clicked was when I stopped looking for answers outside myself and started to feel my emotions viscerally. Over and over. What Monte calls sitting with emotions.
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flyfishnevada
USA
15 Posts |
Posted - 08/27/2014 : 10:17:56
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I was lucky, I guess, that my anger was easy to find. It all started when my father in law took ill and we had to take care of his estate after he died. Delinquent taxes, junk everywhere, and all eleven hours away. That continued as my mother, sister and nephew treated me rather poorly because we decided to spend the Holidays at home. Name calling, my nephew threatened me physically and my mom ignored my feelings completely. Then my wife had to have her gall bladder out, suffered from complication for almost a year and again my family acted poorly. I could go on.
But since I've discovered the little things. Everything from the anger of being in pain, the frustration of being limited physically and the fear of surgery. Anger at my wife and two sons, normal stuff that gets repressed but is still there. The discovery, or admission, that I rarely express my anger and try to be the reasonable one, repressing my feelings.
We all have that anger, big and small. We all repress it to some extent. TMS sufferers seem to be not only too good at repressing it but also people who generate a lot of anger and tension for various reasons. We aren't angry people and that's the problem, we repress it, hide it, dismiss it. We all probably wish we were the ones that read Dr. Sarno's book, realized the pain was a distraction and felt the pain drain away instantly but we aren't so fortunate.
I'm new to this but I'm finding its a combination of realizing the pain is a distraction, dealing with my emotions and overall attitude. They all work together to help alleviate the pain. Still, I know I still haven't 100% bought into TMS. I'm working on it but I have lingering doubts and that surely lets my subconscious do it's thing.
Sometimes people need to hear something in a different way to understand and there are many different paths. Doesn't hurt to keep trying. Sounds like you had some success in the past. You just need to find that place again. Maybe my story, or someone's story, will trigger your healing. |
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jaya
USA
175 Posts |
Posted - 08/27/2014 : 13:16:00
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my advice...sounds rude and harsh....but to the point... stop caring about things out of your control....I did it...you can too!find a hobby/distraction---if someone or something is making you seethe inside---remove them! that's right, remove them!...you get one life-you only get to do this once...life is way to short to be worrying about nonsense all the time...
"Never work so hard to make a living, that you forget to make a life" |
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marsha
252 Posts |
Posted - 08/27/2014 : 13:46:05
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Your advice is not rude.
I have cleaned out my life.
I am an artist. It is difficult to work because of the pain.
My family situation is pretty normal. Right now things are going smoothly. ( aside from my pain,big thing I know)
My husnand is terrific. After 47 years of marriage we are still in love.
We are financially secure. Have friend s for many years.
We are social. Travel is out.
We even look pretty good for old folks.
Not afraid of death just the suffering.
All I do is suffer. My pain is there 24/7.
Was successful with Sarno's in 1999.
I am missing something.... What?
Marsha
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flyfishnevada
USA
15 Posts |
Posted - 08/27/2014 : 18:49:51
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quote:
Originally posted by marsha
Your advice is not rude.
I have cleaned out my life.
I am an artist. It is difficult to work because of the pain.
My family situation is pretty normal. Right now things are going smoothly. ( aside from my pain,big thing I know)
My husnand is terrific. After 47 years of marriage we are still in love.
We are financially secure. Have friend s for many years.
We are social. Travel is out.
We even look pretty good for old folks.
Not afraid of death just the suffering.
All I do is suffer. My pain is there 24/7.
Was successful with Sarno's in 1999.
I am missing something.... What?
Marsha
I want to say it's self-fulfilling, feeding off itself. You're in pain because you're concerned with the pain maybe?. My situation has stabilized and though I still have some anger, I think most of my pain was/is generated by the fear, anxiety and anger about the pain. I was fearful of hurting my "fragile back," anxious about possible surgery or any activity that had me walking or standing for long periods (when my pain manifests usually) and angry about being "handicapped" by the pain and injury.
You speak of pain when you work as a artist and you say travel is out. Those are the two things you mention when you mention pain. There's repressed anger right there. Maybe you need to go back to the beginning, read Dr. Sarno again and follow the advice step by step as if was your first time. Your mind is playing a sort of game. Play along.
Just throwing stuff out there. Maybe it will stick.
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Edited by - flyfishnevada on 08/27/2014 18:51:21 |
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tennis tom
USA
4746 Posts |
Posted - 08/27/2014 : 19:52:50
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quote:
Originally posted by marsha
...I am missing something.... What?
Marsha
Hi Marsha,
Just a guess, maybe you feel like you don't deserve to be happy, a shrink told me that once. Perhaps your life is so good you feel culturally guilty. Perhaps you don't have the basic life survival distractions that those who live paycheck to paychek have and must keep truckin' through their pains--TMS is the VOLUME CONTROL for the pain.
Here's a funny recent find by Skizzik, from comedian Maria Bamford, that has a lot of truth in it for TMS'ers :
"All my friends in Los Angeles are the sensitive type. They all have like all the diseases like Chronic Fatigue, Epstien Barr, Fibromyalgia. Like all the diseases where the only symptoms seem to be you had a really crappy childhood and at the prospect of full time work ya feel kinda achy and tired." |
Edited by - tennis tom on 08/27/2014 20:06:36 |
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miehnesor
USA
430 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2014 : 10:48:37
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Marsha,
One of the BIG mistakes i've made that kept me from symptom relief was to doubt that the inner rage that Dr Sarno talks about as central to the condition really applied to me. I new right off the bat that I had this wounded inner child and that I needed to connect with him to find the answers.
It wasn't until I started acting angry in therapy, even though I didn't feel angry, that I started to experience the bodily sensations which I interpreted as a fear response. The fear was of the rage that I didn't experience till some time later. It was a fake it till you make it kind of approach.
The point I am getting to is to think of yourself as very, very, angry. When you feel pain, validate that you are angry and in your therapy start the process of being angry at the person who you guess you are angry at. It's likely to be someone you are close to and dependent on whether alive now or not.
The inner child speaks to us through the body so try and notice anything different in your body as you share being angry in your therapy. See what happens.
The symptom is a message sent to you from your unconscious telling you that you can not repress this angry any longer.
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jaya
USA
175 Posts |
Posted - 08/28/2014 : 19:37:39
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What are you missing?...you are not letting go....the old inner anger...YOU NEED TO LET IT GO! yes...its really that simple
"Never work so hard to make a living, that you forget to make a life" |
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What difference does it make?
