| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| floorten |
Posted - 05/04/2007 : 08:44:36
This group is really in need of moderation right now.
We could all bicker until the cows come home about politics, but it won't help TMS recovery.
All this argument and outrage is just the ego trying to perpetuate itself through conflict. Every time you let it get away with letting your blood boil over some issue, you generate more physiological and psychological stress responses in your body - responses which if not processed will turn into TMS.
In turn, your pain causes you to be more aggressive, less tolerant and more psychologically out of touch with yourself, furthering a vicious circle - the opposite to the recovery process.
Needing to defend your point of view by attacking others is a legalist and perfectionist tendency. Needing to feel attacked and misunderstood is a goodist one.
Just drop the politics please, everyone. You are playing into TMS, not against it.
--
"What the Thinker thinks, the Prover proves."
Robert Anton Wilson |
| 15 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| floorten |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 14:17:01
Hilary - for me you've hit the nail on the head there.
TT and everyone certainly have the right to express their views here - that's not in doubt (at least for me!).
I don't see it as anger avoidance or repression to not deliberately foster anger inside yourself through open conflict, where there need be no conflict. Flame wars to me are the verbal equivalent of going out looking to start a bar brawl with strangers.
Once the anger has arisen inside you, by all means express it in any way that helps you. Certainly this might include posting on this forum.
And yet, can you see how when a thread runs to 13 pages that this might be an indication that it's the anger that's running the show now, and not you?
I suspect by this point all useful catharsis has taken place and the argument is just self-serving - a knot of stress inside you that won't let go for dear life. To concede ground to the opponents views would be its death. Such discussions will go on and on quite unproductively, until its particpants tire of it.
If anyone suggested to me that such an exchange wouldn't make it more likely for your physiology to create autonomic overload symptoms, I would likely not believe a word of it.
And so, I'll draw my input in this discussion to a close myself, before I get to invested in it too ;-)
--
"What the Thinker thinks, the Prover proves."
Robert Anton Wilson |
| Shary |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 13:38:06
It's no use, TT. We're onto you. We know you're really a terrific guy cleverly disguised as a self-avowed naysayer and grouch.
Here's wishing you peace and good health. |
| art |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 13:16:37
quote:
I find it a comment on the very nature of TMS and its sufferers that the only threads that make it past three pages on this forum are ones which are full of venom, egotism and self-righteousness. I believe healthy people try to steer clear of such destructive persuits, but hey... we get to indulge anything here under the umbrella of "not repressing our feelings
"
I belong to a bunch of forums, and evryone of them has their share of this stuff, unless strictly moderated...I don't believe political debate is "destructive", or something "healthy" people should try to avoid because its somehow going to make them too upset..It's the very stuff of everyday life..Discussion, argument, ego, it's what makes the world go 'round..
Nor do I think forum members are in need of a warning that participating in political, or for that matter any other kind of discussion is somehow going to be deleterious to their recovery..We're all adults here. It's also important to remember that recovery from TMS does not mean finding ways to vanquish anger or other forms of upset. It simply requires an understanding of the underlying relationship between anger and TMS.
My main point is essentially that one has a choice...If debate is not your cup of tea, skip those threads...Moreover, if you find yourself somehow disturbed, or annoyed by them, you've got an opportunity to learn something about yourself..
I read perhaps 20 percent of the stuff posted, if that..It simply wouldn't occur to me to try to somehow limit, or control the stuff that bothers me, or doesn't interest me..
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| HilaryN |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 12:38:38
I’ve just got around to reading an article which 2scoops posted a while back:
http://tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=569
I thought the following quote might be of interest:
“Speaking Your Truth – To release emotions you need to tell one human being one time only about the situation that caused the feeling buried within you. You need to explain in detail what happened, your feelings around this experience, and how this experience is affecting your life today. So often we hide situations and life’s happenings because we are ashamed and somehow feel things happen to us because we are “bad people”. It’s important to tell your complete story in detail to one person. This will help you to gain a healthier perspective on the situation. However, if you keep repeating the story to different people, talking about it repeatedly, thinking about it over and over again, this becomes a resentment (a recurring negative thought). The resentment then becomes another problem rather than part of the solution.
Secrets are shame-based and incidents kept secret or feelings hidden from others will make these feelings deeper and longer lasting. Emotional secrets lead to emotional and mental illness.”
(My bold.)
Although this is about personal experiences maybe it could also apply to those who have trouble dealing with items in the news.
Greg, Thanks for posting this thread.
Hilary N |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 12:01:23
quote:
Originally posted by floorten
...The issue for me here was just whether it's collectively helping or hindering us to be using the forum as a focus of expression..
Point well taken Floorten. My question being, is there room on the kibbutz, for the expression of individual views, regarding matters that float one's TMS boat, on the reservoir of rage?
My views, usually in the minority, on non-TMS topics, do I have the right, here, to to give a counter-view to "off-topic" statements, that I view as in-accurate?
some of my favorite excerpts from 'TDM' : http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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| floorten |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 11:26:47
Tom, I believe that too is true. The issue for me here was just whether it's collectively helping or hindering us to be using the forum as a focus of expression, and probably of inflammation, of these emotions
--
"What the Thinker thinks, the Prover proves."
Robert Anton Wilson |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 10:58:28
quote:
Originally posted by floorten
I believe healthy people try to steer clear of such destructive persuits...
Or on the other side of the coin, perhaps healthy people don't shy away from conflict and voice their opinion on subjects they feel passionately about, not repressing/suppressing their true feelings.
Regards,
tt
self avowed naysayer/grouch
some of my favorite excerpts from 'TDM' : http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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| Shary |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 09:58:52
Greg, your wisdom and clear-sightedness in cutting to the core of the issue are appreciated by most of us. Don't let the grouches and the naysayers get to you. |
| floorten |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 09:51:59
quote:
Originally posted by art
The other type has to do with the socially interactive nature of the forum...We read, we post, we get angry, we feel good, we feel comforted, we feel threatened...The question should be, it seems to me, what can we learn about ourselves thereby?...Why do we sometimes react so strongly to a bunch of black squiggles on a white screen posted by people wer'e never going to meet? What do our reactions say about us as human beings? And how can we use this information to better understand the internal dynamics that have given rise to the pain in our lives?
There was no protest in my original post. Just a warning that the bickering could be counter-productive.
You make it sound noble, but all that seems to happen is a bunch of people getting together to call each other names and get self-righteous about their chosen political cause. I have a hard time believing that this is really helping anyone recover from TMS.
I find it a comment on the very nature of TMS and its sufferers that the only threads that make it past three pages on this forum are ones which are full of venom, egotism and self-righteousness. I believe healthy people try to steer clear of such destructive persuits, but hey... we get to indulge anything here under the umbrella of "not repressing our feelings".
Greg
--
"What the Thinker thinks, the Prover proves."
Robert Anton Wilson |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 05/05/2007 : 09:04:24
OH MY GAWD! I agree with Art, wholeheartedly, what is this forum coming to?
some of my favorite excerpts from 'TDM' : http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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| art |
Posted - 05/05/2007 : 05:15:17
I'm not understanding why a few threads about politics would bother people so much..If someone's upset enough to entitle a thread "yawn" in protest, I would suggest they follow Dave's advice and look within...
There re two types of learning available in a forum like this...The first is the simple gathering of basic TMS information, all of which by the way can, as TT has recently pointed out, be quickly and easily found in Dr. Sarno's books.
The other type has to do with the socially interactive nature of the forum...We read, we post, we get angry, we feel good, we feel comforted, we feel threatened...The question should be, it seems to me, what can we learn about ourselves thereby?...Why do we sometimes react so strongly to a bunch of black squiggles on a white screen posted by people wer'e never going to meet? What do our reactions say about us as human beings? And how can we use this information to better understand the internal dynamics that have given rise to the pain in our lives?
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| Singer_Artist |
Posted - 05/04/2007 : 22:23:49
Floorten,
I agree 100 percent..I, thankfully, have learned this particular lesson that time I had that awful thread about my trying to promote my art...never again...Off topic, long winded threads with horrible conflict are painful for those involved and for those reading it..Not to mention they can potentially scare off newcomers..What I am going through in my life right now is so stressful that it has put many things into perspective for me..
Take care,
Karen |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 05/04/2007 : 09:28:21
On second thought I'm not so sure anymore. Maybe benign neglect is the best milieu. Maybe if we have a board suicide or serial killing we could debate it.
Some of my favorite excerpts from 'TDM' : http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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| tennis tom |
Posted - 05/04/2007 : 09:25:41
Floorten, I agree with you wholeheartedly, (moderation but not necessarily a moderator). By the way how are feelings between the Turks living in Germany and the Germans these days? 
Cheers,
tt
some of my favorite excerpts from 'TDM' : http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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| Shary |
Posted - 05/04/2007 : 09:20:06
Floorten, great comment. I think you're right on all counts. Thanks for the reminder to those who feel anger, aggression and intolerance are harmless as long as they aren't repressed. I'm all for airing TMS-related annoyances, but only in passing and not to the extent that they become a podium for various forms of outrage. |
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