| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| filipe |
Posted - 07/09/2012 : 17:05:40
Dear all
I’m 38 years old and I live in Portugal. Due to financial issues it’s impossible for me to go to the USA to be seen by a
TMS specialist.
Three years ago I started doing some exercises with dumbells at home. During one particular exercise I remember feeling an
electric shock that went from my elbow to the tip of my fingers. One day I woke up with what I discover later was severe
neuropathic pain on both arms. Although the EMG was normal, I did an ultrasonography and it showed that my ulnar
peripheral nerve was inflamed.
Despite being better, this inflammation became chronic. One week ago I did another ecography and my ulnar nerve is still
inflamed, which makes it very hard for me to work, namely on the computer, and bending my elbow. In the meantime I read
lots of your books and learnt about the TMS syndrome. However, from what I read on the Net, people say there is no
inflammation and that’s exactly the key issue here because in my case there’s definitely chronic inflammation.
Can you help me figure it out if my problem is TMS? Can you answer me these questions?
-What do you think is perpetuating this chronic inflammation? Do you think it could be a result of the ulnar nerve being
compressed unconsciously by muscles/tendons? Is it this kind of tenderness TMS is all about? Can TMS also be applied here when there's inflammation? If so, why does it
tend to get worse on hot weather?
(this is the noise that my elbow does when I bend it):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6-ANtdnlVU
-What is your opinion about nerve entrapment syndromes with proven inflammation? What is your opinion on neuropathic pain?
Do nerves fully heal?
-Can oxygen deprivation /ischemia cause inflammation?
-When inflammation is present can we discard a mind-body syndrome?
-Does inflammation cause pain necessarily?
-What is your view on people that say they feel worse with sudden weather changes?
-Could chronic inflammation be perpetuated by an autonomic nervous system not functioning right due to emotional problems?
I do not have any autoimmune disease that could somehow justify chronic neurogenic inflammation.
Please help me I have a son that needs a healthy and active father.
Thanks a lot
God bless you
Filipe |
| 20 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| art |
Posted - 07/26/2012 : 08:55:24
"I also saw on another thread, someone say "not all things are TMS." They went on to explain that their thing occurred routinely. But routine things are more likely TMS because of conditioning, and the body's stored memory. I would like to know what comes round every so often that's not TMS? It could happen but it's rare. So beware of the brain fooling you into thinking you have a real injury or real problem because that's exactly what your brain wants you to think. "
Hey Steve,
I don't know that it was me, but it certainly could have been. In my opinion I see the "when all you've got is a hammer, everything looks like a nail" syndrome all the time on this fine forum. A good example is your statement, "absolutely, swelling is part of the TMS process." Well fine, let's accept that. BUt you have to be careful to draw lines. I assume you'd agree that swelling is not always TMS. Perhaps not even usually.
I've had swelling with a fractured bone, with torn tendons (twice), and a torn ligament. IN all cases..well perhaps not the fracture... had I just wandered onto this board and asked the usual newbie question, I'd likely have been told, "No worries. If you fit the personality profile it's very likely TMS.
I broke my ankle some years ago, much pain, much swelling, and not realizing I had a break. I went on my merry (but deeply pain-ridden) way, in the process doing my ankle much harm. Very stupid on my part, granted.
I had a similar experience very recently when I ignored knee pain and swelling on the assumption it was TMS. I have a substantial tear now and can't run for months. I turned what would have been a month on the sidelines into one of the most debilitating running injuries of my life.
You've got the fire of an evangelist, And you're going to be quite popular around here. And that's fine. We need charismatic voices. I personally have much interest in your point of view. I'm just counseling a little more balance. And in fairness, since I've not read too many of your posts, perhaps you're endeavoring to do that...
Edit: I'd also like to add, and correct me if you think I'm wrong, that swelling associated with genuine bursitis cannot be ignored in the way one ignores a painful back. Using an actually inflamed, leaking joint as if it weren't injured in the slightest, is I don't believe a wise thing to do.
By the way, what's your take on inflammation? |
| SteveO |
Posted - 07/25/2012 : 22:53:30
Erata, on my page 182 I have an example of what happened to you (except the wedding part)that was published in Basic Principles of Psychoanalysis. Thanks for letting me know it still happens. Amazing.The reverse is also true. I wrote about it in GPD; 2 people I know have their pain stop immediately if someone touches them. This is why chiro adjustments sometimes work in the short term. Human touch trumps all placebo modalities because it connects the unconnected which is what people desperately need--to feel connected and away from the fear of isolation. And love is the only true answer.
Swelling is absolutely part of the TMS process. Dr. Sarno wrote early on that the anti-inflammatories wouldn't work because no one had proved there was swelling in the spine, and he's still right, no one has.
But he's seen swelling elsewhere. I've had it, Dr. Sopher has had it, and I've seen around 12 people who get it regularly. It's also a part of something called pseudo-gout which mimics gout without the elevated uric acid. I know a lawyer whose elbow swells when he's in court and under stress. Stress can cause swelling and bleeding and anything you can imagine.
I worked with a man on his TMS who was bleeding rectally. His work and family had gotten to him. His was extreme tension induced bleeding and it was seen on a colonoscopy. He finally healed after understanding that he was under enough stress to alter his physiology. But swelling and bleeding can be dangerous signs and they should be treated with great caution. They need to be checked out---all the time.
I spoke with Filipe, who started this thread, by Skype. He was such a nice guy and very intelligent. He was visibly shaken and in panic attack mode. I couldn't calm him down so he needed his symptom from something deeper. There was some work there to be done.
His pudendal neuraligia was his protector and punisher. Remember, these "real problems" more often have psychological bases. They can be over come by those same mechanisms. His doctor had crippled him with a dire warning, and as Dr. Sarno said they are creating a nation of the partially disabled. Filipe's nation was Portugal but it's the same idea.
Also, be careful of falling into the "it's part of aging" snare. I've seen people in their 70s heal from TMS, who are now in their 80s and they feel fine. I feel better than I did 30 years ago, and for those who like math they can figure out how much older I am than I was 30 years ago.
Does the body eventually break down? Of course. We know that the reason we eventually die is due to cell oxidation. They simply wear down over time if we are lucky. Most of these aging things are part of the mindbody syndrome. If a joint wears out it needs replaced, but the bursa and other areas are fine and rarely subject to such wear that they would cause daily pain.
I also saw on another thread, someone say "not all things are TMS." They went on to explain that their thing occurred routinely. But routine things are more likely TMS because of conditioning, and the body's stored memory. I would like to know what comes round every so often that's not TMS? It could happen but it's rare. So beware of the brain fooling you into thinking you have a real injury or real problem because that's exactly what your brain wants you to think.
Steve
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| art |
Posted - 07/25/2012 : 06:00:37
quote:
Originally posted by tennis tom
Art FYI,
SteveO mentions swelling as a TMS manifestation and the Good Doctor uses the terms psychosomatic and TMS interchangeably.
Hope that helps.
Yes, I agree that TMS and psychomatic are synonyms.Accepting for the moment that swelling is indeed sometimes a TMS manifestation in no way implies that it always is. That's pretty self evident. |
| tennis tom |
Posted - 07/24/2012 : 21:09:43
Art FYI,
SteveO mentions swelling as a TMS manifestation and the Good Doctor uses the terms psychosomatic and TMS interchangeably.
Hope that helps. |
| art |
Posted - 07/24/2012 : 18:53:01
quote:
Originally posted by Erata
I experienced Bursitis two years ago just after my daughter’s wedding and have no doubt mine was stress related. My ex-husband (our very long and acrimonious divorce had finally been finalized two months prior) was there with his new partner and we were all being civilized for my daughter’s sake. At one point, he put his hand on my elbow in a very showy display of support (showy, because he’d also tried to sue me for over $200K with a vindictive & punitive lawsuit). When I was undressing that evening, I was shocked & alarmed to find a golf-ball sized swelling on the same elbow. I showed my friend, who recognized it as Bursitis, and she assured me it hadn’t been visible earlier (I’d worn a short sleeved blouse to the wedding and sure hadn’t noticed it when I got dressed). The swelling & slight pain gradually decreased over time.
I’m certain the Bursitis episode was a physical manifestation of repressing my rage with someone I experienced as so toxic to my well being, and that he dared to touch me. (Because, man, did I resent politely brushing him off when I really wanted to bitch slap him!)
erata.
That's all very interesting. That's actually a great story. And I agree that bursitis can indeed be stress related. IN my mind however, that's not the same as psychosomatic, which implies one can safely ignore the apparent injury/problem. |
| Erata |
Posted - 07/24/2012 : 17:21:12
I experienced Bursitis two years ago just after my daughter’s wedding and have no doubt mine was stress related. My ex-husband (our very long and acrimonious divorce had finally been finalized two months prior) was there with his new partner and we were all being civilized for my daughter’s sake. At one point, he put his hand on my elbow in a very showy display of support (showy, because he’d also tried to sue me for over $200K with a vindictive & punitive lawsuit). When I was undressing that evening, I was shocked & alarmed to find a golf-ball sized swelling on the same elbow. I showed my friend, who recognized it as Bursitis, and she assured me it hadn’t been visible earlier (I’d worn a short sleeved blouse to the wedding and sure hadn’t noticed it when I got dressed). The swelling & slight pain gradually decreased over time.
I’m certain the Bursitis episode was a physical manifestation of repressing my rage with someone I experienced as so toxic to my well being, and that he dared to touch me. (Because, man, did I resent politely brushing him off when I really wanted to bitch slap him!)
|
| art |
Posted - 07/24/2012 : 13:35:05
I'm always reluctant to read of symptoms and illnesses that are unknown to me for fear of planting the suggestion...
filpe...I have a similar problem with my thumb. Not as painful or debilitating as yours, but I can't play golf anymore and it's a major nuisance.
I'm a long time TMS sufferer and by and large have had great success with TMS self treatment. However the nerve thing, along with some swelling from bursitis has set me back some. To be honest, I have a difficult time accepting that inflammation and swelling can be TMS. I thought I'd read or heard somewhere that sarno treats swelling as evidence of genuine physical problems, and to a certain extent that seem manifestly true to me. Which is to say swelling and inflammation are by defnition physical...
Be interested to hear more SteveO
edit: just to add, I recently kept running with a swollen knee. Ovet a few weeks it finally got so bad I ended up in the hospital where an MRI revealed inflammation and a significant tear in quadriceps tendon. At that point of course I had to accept diagnosis. A complete tear is a serious event in the quadriceps tendon, requiring surgery and a good 6 months rehab |
| lara |
Posted - 07/24/2012 : 13:19:41
Glowgirl,
Thats exactly my diagnoses! if i hadn't find this forum i would be screamming on my bed,reading posts from a nocebo website for pudendal.sufferes etc
But i decided to take control of my body not my mind controling jt.
i cant say i am pain free but now i can do almost everything i was used to before that horrible diagnose. My pain has increased these days due to stress and mixed emotions with fam issues. What "treatment" are you following apart for the tms approach for the PNE?
i am.still on neurontin ..tms dr says im not ready yet for weanning off.
keep on doing the tms work !!!
A warmth hug .
Lara |
| glowgirl |
Posted - 07/24/2012 : 11:29:12
i was diagnosed with "pudendal neuraligia"
boy did that freak me out.
my entire being screamed NO!
it is slowly getting better...
having read steve's book, i visualize every day that my body is perfectly healed.
pudendal neuraligia is a horrible diagnosis considered experimental even by the medical community. it costs thousands of $$$ to have procedures and expensive surgeries whose outcomes are dubious at best.
makes TMS healing look extremely attractive!
i think sometimes doctors and others just say that when they themselves don't know what is going on.
hope you get better really fast because neuraligia can be really tough.
since i've been telling mine to get the f**k out of Dodge (my body) and also look at my emotions and the incidents that happened when i got it... i think that all has helped alot. |
| SteveO |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 17:18:58
I have you on skype, I called but you're probably in bed rolling around sleeplessly worrying. i've been out of school so long I had to look up the captital of Portugal.
World clock says you're a few minutes after midnight now.
I'll check back later,
|
| SteveO |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 15:55:25
Filipe, don't worry, you will be ok if you have TMS. You're physician has scared you into more serious problems, they do that often, it's called a nocebo effect, if they take action and it harms you it's called an iatrogenic effect or a civil suit.
I will try to help you. Breathe deeply, relax, and try to calm down. When you tell me you just had a new baby then I know why you have TMS.
Worry makes you worse.
But you have to tell me what time zone you're in. It's 6 PM EST here where I live in Ohio.
Figure out a good time to talk and I'll talk to you. I will add you in skype now to see if you're there now. Give your wife a break to hold the baby, you can type, it will actually help you.
Rest easy...
Esteban/Steve |
| filipe |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 14:35:37
Hello esteban
I'm a computer teacher and right now I cannot perform my duties. actually my wife is writing this for me. I feel a lot of pain when I bend my elbows like when we are in a computer.
My physiotherapist says my muscles are so thight that they are compressing my nerves. Of course I think it's the other way around. That is, I have my nerves so inflammed that they are tightnhing the muscles.On the other hand, I cannot forget the image of my ulnar nerve being pinched. And also that nerves can't fully heal.
I'm afraid of losing my job, and I start crying everytime I look at my son.
Did you add me on skype?
I really need someone to talk to about this.
thanks
Filipe |
| filipe |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 14:16:50
I would love to talk to you :)
I'm in a lot of stress and fear. I'm also a recent dad.
What i wanted to tell you is that we can actually inflammed ourselves trough our emotions/CNS... |
| SteveO |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 14:11:24
CFS is not an autoimmune disorder. That article is way off the truth.
You appear to be in that panic state where you look up diseases on the internet and then try to tie them to your own situation. Don't do that.
Stay away from the internet and health books like Mark Twain told us to. Keep reading about TMS. As long as your doctor has ruled out anything life threatening you should be looking at an emotional cause.
You can get yourself caught up in an anxiety panic by trying to diagnose yourself. Mark Twain said, "I have been through some terrible things in my life, some of which actually happened."
Don't look for problems. If you want to talk let me know.
I also owe several calls to other people. I try to pick the ones who are in panic mode first, but I need to talk to those here who I promised. I will email you soon.
Esteban |
| filipe |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 13:53:14
I think that this is what is perpetuating my problem:
http://forums.phoenixrising.me/index.php?threads/link-discovered-between-the-nervous-and-immune-systems-might-lead-to-new-treatments.1336/
Please read it..
However, I don't think they will invest on this. They might end curing all diseases ;) |
| drh7900 |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 13:14:17
Filipe - you can find his book on Amazon ("The Great Pain Deception" by Steven Ray Ozanich) or on his website paindeception.com.
And I always find myself chuckling at SteveO's subtle humor. Like signing his name as "Esteban" because he's talking to someone in Portugal...that's just awesome lol.
--
Dustin |
| filipe |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 13:03:53
It will be great. Did you add my contact already? By the way you didn't send me your link to the book.
I've been in pain for 3 years. My symptoms are more related to weird sensations. I'm afraid of suffering from RSD or something neurodegenerative. Do you know what it is?
Thanks |
| SteveO |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 12:49:23
We have to figure a time and day to skype. what's the time difference between us?
I have an important skype Wednesday with a TMS sufferer in Ireland, but I can skype Thursday if we can set a time. That's July 12. I'm available in early evening here, 5 8 PM or so
Esteban
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| filipe |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 12:29:47
Can you send me the link to your book?
My skype is:
filipegarciaboy, please contact me :( I'm in panic.... |
| SteveO |
Posted - 07/10/2012 : 11:54:20
Filipe
I watched your video. I wonder if it will go viral?
You have lots of strength and power in your arm in that video, it's hard to believe you have an entrapped nerve, but I'm not s doctor. That clicking popping sound means nothing, most people have clicking sounds in their joints.
I trapped my radial nerve for a minute in elbow therapy in rehabilitation and it paralyzed my hand. page 67 was the page in my book where I explained what happened to me.
I don't know what a cubital tunnel is but unconscious tension can cause every health problem imaginable so it certainly can cause "compression."
Unfortunately many doctors like to scare people with dire warnings of danger. It's a good way to make money. Your doctor certainly has you frightened, luckily you found out about TMS. How did you discover TMS?
Only an MD can properly diagnose TMS, but most of us had to diagnose ourselves because most doctors don't know about TMS and don't really care about TMS.
You're in a panic mode. You have to think wisely, do you have full strength in your arm? Is it in serious pain? Is it numb? Are you under stress at home and work?
Do you have Skype? If you have it you can contact me. I can't diagnose you but I can help you understand more.
Be calm, relax, and learn about TMS. Find another doctor for a second opinion.
EstebanO |
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