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LuvtoSew
USA
327 Posts |
 Posted - 08/24/2009 : 20:40:51
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I just sometimes wonder, I'm a Roman Catholic, and sometimes I feel this maybe a hindrance to getting better, although I know it shouldn't be, I mean I would never give up my beliefs, but you know it is best not to retaliate to hurt anyone or cause anyone pain, and of course we are not to harbor grudges or anger towards anyone. I know this is just being a good person, but the tongue is the most powerful weapon on earth..
there is someone who hurt me physically and although I know it was not intentional, she caused pain in two areas of my body, and two years later it is still there, and I have tried to forgive her and forget her but the pain in those places are still present.
I so much want to let her know how she caused me this physical pain, because I feel if I let her know-as you can tell it causes anger in me no matter how much I prayer to forgive her - that these pain areas would leave, as I can even see her face , but then I don't want her to have to live with the guilt in her life from hurting me , if you know what I mean.
Of course I beieve its better to be hurt , than to hurt, better to be stole from than to steal, etc.
So how do you deal with your Godly beliefs , and get better, without hurting anyone in the process.
Also there are times I would love to soemtimes just answere back to some rude person, but of course I just let it slide and be nice instead.
I don't know.
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flutterby
United Kingdom
79 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2009 : 04:34:09
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Forgiveness is a tricky subject!
You may find some pointers here to resolving your anger (which will lead to forgiveness) http://www.thepresenceportal.com/ I don't believe anything Michael Brown writes/says would go against your religious beliefs, though I may be wrong there.
There is a lot to read and a lot to listen to or watch on his website but my understanding is that what he's saying is that you need to 'be with your anger, without condition' in order to resolve it. 'Feel it to heal it'. (It's not about getting back at the person who hurt you, or even forgiving and forgetting them - it's about you and your anger.)
You can also email him with your queries, which he is very quick to reply to.
Hope this helps.
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RageSootheRatio
Canada
430 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2009 : 07:28:14
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Just an idea .. but do you think it might help if you wrote her a letter (which you didn't send) and then "she" wrote "you" back? (ie if you then imagined that you were her and wrote back what you really wished you could hear from her. )
A related idea .. do you think it might help if you tried a "two-chair" approach .. whereby you sit in your chair and talk to "her" (in the empty chair across from you) and then sat in "her" chair (being her) and then replied to yourself?
Is there someone (your priest, a therapist, a close friend) who you could talk to, about this? or role-play it with?
Another thought: Maybe you can't "forgive" her because she hasn't actually said she was sorry and taken any responsibility or explained why it happened and how it won't happen again? Is there a particular reason why it would not be a good idea to actually talk to her about what happened? (Maybe you've already done this, so just asking as it wasn't clear.) If you "don't want her to have to live with the guilt in her life from hurting you" is there a reason you are trying to "protect" her? Maybe some guilt is a good thing in that she would *learn* from this experience and make amends (say sorry) and then not feel guilty any more and not hurt other people in the same way in the future?
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LuvtoSew
USA
327 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2009 : 12:57:14
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| Thanks for the good suggestions, shes a chiro, needless to say I've never been to a chiro again. |
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makeupservice
United Kingdom
4 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2009 : 14:22:47
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quote:
Originally posted by flutterby
Forgiveness is a tricky subject!
You may find some pointers here to resolving your anger (which will lead to forgiveness) http://www.thepresenceportal.com/ I don't believe anything Michael Brown writes/says would go against your religious beliefs, though I may be wrong there.
There is a lot to read and a lot to listen to or watch on his website but my understanding is that what he's saying is that you need to 'be with your anger, without condition' in order to resolve it. 'Feel it to heal it'. (It's not about getting back at the person who hurt you, or even forgiving and forgetting them - it's about you and your anger.)
You can also email him with your queries, which he is very quick to reply to.
Hope this helps.
Wendy Haigh |
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makeupservice
United Kingdom
4 Posts |
Posted - 08/25/2009 : 14:28:10
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I recently started on the programme and found that I needed to forgive someone who hurt me deeply seriously affecting my life and that of family members.the stress of this post traumatic stress syndrome/TMS was so great my body seized up and I was full of pain and stiff everywhere.I journaled a letter to her telling her how I felt advising her of what her actions had done to me ,then shredded it!So far I am pain free and much more mobile,thanks to my UK practitioner and the books of Dr John Sarno.hope this helps someone.
Wendy Haigh |
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pandamonium
United Kingdom
202 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 05:01:30
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r2r & flutterby have some good ideas.
Whilst I don't believe you need to forgive the chiro, you do need to feel that anger and get it out of you. Journalling or role playing can do this. I do think it's important to see it from their point of view too.
Once you've gotten all that emotion out the forgiveness bit (for me) becomes irrelevant.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
A beginner's guide to psychology: If it's not your mum's fault.... it's your dad's... |
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drziggles
USA
292 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 11:04:16
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If you feel that this chiropractor physically hurt you through manipulation, and that you still have pain because of something she physically did, the bigger problem could be that you may not have accepted the TMS concept fully. Sounds like you are hanging your hat on this physical cause for your problems, that may or may not actually be the cause.
This is complete speculation since you haven't said what happened, but sounds like there is something else going on...
Naturally, you should consult with your MD before making any medical decisions... |
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Peg
USA
284 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 11:45:12
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My response is similar to Dr. Z.
If you were hurt physically two years ago, it would have healed by now. Muscular pain due to bruising, strained ligaments, tendons, heck, even a broken bone would have healed in a matter of weeks. If you are still having pain, it is probably due to the emotions surrounding the supposed insult (physical), or emotions about something else going on in your life. Could your anger at the chiro be displaced from someone or something else in your life?
It sounds like you are not attributing this pain to TMS, which it probably is. Either that or you do not fully understand TMS theory.
I'm not sure I want to get into organized religion and TMS, but since that was your main question, I will. I do think that the pressures, rules, control, beliefs which are ingrained in us from an early age by the church, can contribute to guilt, low self esteem and a feeling of powerlessness. This will certainly feed into TMS. I consider myself a recovering catholic and I have unearthed more than a little rage towards the organization (church).
Told you I probably shouldn't go there.
Just my 2c.
Feel better. Take care.
Peg
In questions of science, the authority of a thousand is not worth the humble reasoning of a single individual. Galileo Galilei |
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hottm8oh
USA
141 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 14:54:16
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I have to agree with drziggles and Peg....you are misplacing the cause of the pain and therefore prolonging your symptoms.
I was also "hurt" by a chiropractor. It didn't last long, thankfully, because once I discovered TMS, I realized I hadn't been hurt at all. My panic at the fear of being hurt made me hurt more.
Maybe you can't forgive the chiropractor because there's nothing to forgive. Maybe you are angry at the pain that made you seek out a chiro in the first place. Just something to consider... |
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mizlorinj
USA
490 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2009 : 18:47:51
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Luv: When I saw Dr. Sarno and we talked about my upbringing being in a strict religious household, he said I would be even more prone to tms because of the guilt factor. I have done a lot of writing about this and forgiven myself for doing what I thought was right at the time. (no longer involved). I also have forgiven those from whom I perceived feeling "wronged". Didn't happen overnight though. We are human. We have feelings!
As others here, I vote for writing the feelings letters to this person. These letters are truly therapueutic. Get out whatever you need to say--totally uncensored (then shred or burn it!). Also keep in mind your mind is your mind, and we don't know what's going on in someone else's.
Also after 2 years your body has healed. I'd say this pain in a familiar spot is a way of keeping you distracted.
Best wishes,
L |
Edited by - mizlorinj on 08/26/2009 18:49:35 |
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2scoops
USA
386 Posts |
Posted - 08/31/2009 : 14:15:29
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If you want a more spiritual/Chrisitan approach to this than I highly suggest you read Henry Wright's A More Excellent Way, and also Art Mathias's Biblical Foundations of Freedom.
I went to some seminars last week to see Art Mathias and it was amazing. One lady had developed Fibromyalgia, and Art walked up to her and asked who hurt her. She said her husband verbally abused her. She had held bitterness towards him, and about a year ago, he passed away. She confessed that she blamed herself and God. She started crying, and Art prayed with her and immediately her sciatics left. She went back the next day and said he walked up the stairs without pain for the first time in years. She had some pain from other areas of her body, and Art told her to keep praying and confessing.
It's amamzing how much hurt we hold on to. They basically say that pain and disease can come from breakdown in relaionships in 3 areas: Our relationship with God, with others and ourselves. We wnat to look at bitterness and unforgiveness, jealousy, envy, rejection, fear, anxiety, and stress.
Now I'm notsure about what Roman Catholic teaches, because I'm not big into religion. Art and Henry teach from the bible. |
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Wavy Soul
USA
779 Posts |
Posted - 08/31/2009 : 17:50:34
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Wow! I confess it, I'm angry and still hold resentment to a few people. I'm working on it, and really trying to let go and offer it all for release.
After reading the above post about Christian approach to TMS, I went to Art Matthias' website and found a bunch very good reasons to come to this Forum and confess (so to speak - perhaps I'm being a bit liberal here by comparing "sharing" to "confessing"). At any rate, the following list, from his site, seems to suggest that just keeping it all buried inside won't get you where you want to go...
"This is what Scripture has to say about confessed and unconfessed sins:
Confessed Sins:
1. They are blotted out (Isaiah 44:22; Acts 3:19).
2. They are forgiven (Exodus 34:7; I John 1:9; I John 2:12).
3. They are remitted (Matthew 26:28; Mark 1:4).
4. They are made white as snow (Isaiah 1:18).
5. They are made as wool (Isaiah 1:18).
6. They are cast behind God's back (Isaiah 38:17).
7. They are forgotten (Isaiah 43:25; Hebrews 8:12; Hebrews 10:17).
8. They are purged away (Psalm 79:9; Hebrews 1:3).
9. They are covered (Psalm 32:1; Romans 4:7).
10. They are put away (II Samuel 12:13; Hebrews 9:22)."
11. They are removed as far as the east is from the west (Psalm 103:12).
12. They are cast into the depths of the sea (Micah 7:19).
13. They are washed away (Rev. 1:5).
14. They are taken away (I John 3:5).
15. They are put off (Col. 2:11).
16. One is saved from them (Matthew 1:21).
17. One is freed from them (Romans 6:7,16-23; Romans 8:2).
18. One is cleansed from them (I John 1:7,9).
19. One becomes dead to them (Col. 2:13; I Peter 2:24).
20. One is quickened from death in them (Ephes. 2:1-10; Col. 2:13).
Unconfessed Sins:
1. They cause death (Genesis 2:17; Ezekiel 33:8-13; Romans 8:12-13).
2. They hinder prayers (Psalm 66:18).
3. They provoke God to anger (I Kings 16:2).
4. They weary God (Isaiah 43:24).
5. They separate from God (Isaiah 59:2).
6. They testify against us (Isaiah 59:12; Jeremiah 14:7).
7. They cause God to remember them (Psalm 25:7).
8. They expose guilt (Psalm 69:5).
9. They cause God to visit (Hosea 8:13; Hosea 9:9).
10. They us load down (II Tim. 3:6, Hebrews 12:1).
11. They cause us to pine away (Ezekiel 33:10; Leviticus 26:39).
12. They cause us to be consumed (Isaiah 64:7; Ezekiel 4:17).
13. They take men away (Isaiah 64:6).
14. They bring punishment (Amos 3:2).
15. They damn the soul (II Thes. 2:12; Matthew 16:16).
16. They cause one to be of Satan (1 John 3:8).
17. They cause hardening of heart (Hebrews 3:13).
18. They make servants of sin (Romans 6:7-23; John 8:34).
19. They bring reproach (Proverbs 14:34).
20. They cause national judgment (Amos 1:3,6,9,11,13; Amos 2:1,4,6).
21. They cause disease (Deut. 28; Ps.103:3; Mark 2:9; James 5:16).
22. They cause many troubles and calamities in life (Job; Deut. 28; Proverbs 1:27-31).
Love is the answer, whatever the question |
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2scoops
USA
386 Posts |
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2scoops
USA
386 Posts |
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LuvtoSew
USA
327 Posts |
Posted - 09/02/2009 : 14:08:26
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thank you all for your very good answers , I will check out the websites. I know I keep things inside and need to release them and what ever quilt I have and anger over what some people have done to me.
2 scoops- so you went to the seminar. The Catholic religion teaches the same, forgiveness and confession and repent and yes we believe in the Bible of course and I read the Bible daily. Of course we have the extra stuff that Christians don't agree with like mortal sin, not being married in church is living in sin, and etc. Like I'm not allowed to receive communion since we were married by a judge 23 years ago and 4 years ago we were going to get our marriage blessed, but I haven't been up to it.
I did take Rev. Wrights book out again, and he says the same thing, fear, envy, unforgiveness, bitterness, etc are all things that cause us pain and disease, and the biggy I feel is quilt. I think I'll reread his book.
Oh she had an electric activator and it was set on high impluse and she did it on my occipital bone on the side by my ear and said oophs,
well I still have that head pressue- constant, did go for a cat scan but it was normal. |
Edited by - LuvtoSew on 09/02/2009 17:31:51 |
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LuvtoSew
USA
327 Posts |
Posted - 09/02/2009 : 19:24:55
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I was thinking tho , I know people that don't talk or want anything to do with a family member, a friend who hasn't spoke to her Mom in years and said never will, and people that gossip alot and want this and that and thier world revolves around their possessions, have affairs , and for some reason they are not in pain, so is it that
us people have guilt that causes our pain. they just go on their merry way and live happy go lucky lives , not really caring if they hurt other people or not. I mean I know some that could screw you out of money and feel great about it, and they aren't in pain.
So it must be our guilt and leads us to pain and then fear?
I don't know , it doessn't make sense. That guy that kidnapped that young girl and father two of her children doesn't seem to be in pain,
so its sure a mystery. |
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drziggles
USA
292 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2009 : 11:47:06
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No mystery at all. People who are perfectionists and "goodists" develop these problems, and it would seem pretty obvious that being Catholic is a complete set up for that!
I would like to see a study addressing this, but I would imagine that sociopaths are much less likely to develop pain issues, because they have no guilt or need to please anyone but themselves.
And, after hearing your problem with the chiropractor, the actual event likely has nothing at all to do with your current problem, so it's time to let it go and figure out what the real issues are...
Once again, you should consult with your MD before making any medical decisions. |
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guej
115 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2009 : 12:28:05
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| I couldn't resist answering this one either. I'm the product of 12 years of Catholic school and a lifetime of Catholic guilt. Talk about being brought up to be a good little respectful girl. We weren't allowed to ever question authority figures, to answer back and stand up for ourselves, and we had to be "nice" to everyone because God was always watching. I've done enough self-analysis through journaling to see how that carried over to work, relationships, etc. I put up with so much crap at work that others would never have stood for. I was afraid to stand up for myself. I shoved so much resentment inside while I did what everyone asked of me, no matter how unreasonable. It's the perfect storm for a "goodist" personality. That's why I think I also respected whatever doctors told me (initially, anyway). You just didn't question authority! I'm not disavowing my religion by any means. I just can see now how that type of upbringing seems fine on the outside, but really festers on the inside of a person. |
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LuvtoSew
USA
327 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2009 : 17:11:08
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drziggles
You said "I would like to see a study addressing this, but I would imagine that sociopaths are much less likely to develop pain issues, because they have no guilt or need to please anyone but themselves"
I do believe your right. but I'm not willing to sell my soul to the devil and become a sociopath to be out of pain,,,,,,,,,,Ha Ha. |
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flutterby
United Kingdom
79 Posts |
Posted - 09/03/2009 : 17:25:38
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| LuvtoSew - surely there is third option, rather than being a suffering goodist/perfectionist (whether religion-induced or not) and being a painfree sociopath? The option I'm referring to is actually resolving your anger/resentment and therefore your guilt about your anger/resentment? |
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Being a Christian and Tms
