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art
1903 Posts |
 Posted - 05/06/2007 : 16:09:22
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This is something which I've not had much success with, although Dr. Sarno calls it a TMS equivalent. I don't have it bad luckily. But when leaving the house, I'm a lock checker, and a stove checker, and a toilet checker (to make sure they're not running)...It sometimes takes me 2 or 3 minutes before I'm out of the house
I fight it, but usually lose. What does me in is the thought that the energy and time expended in checking is such a small investment when weighed against the various calamities I'm trying to avoid..floods, fires, thefts, etc etc..
The key for me is fixing in memory the fact that I've checked. Once this is done, the little doubting gremlins cease their chatter and I'm free...
Still and all, it's a waste of time. JUst thought I'd throw this out there and see what those who might have similar issues have done..
Many thanks,
A.
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sensei adam rostocki
USA
167 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 17:05:07
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OCD is one of the psychological equilevents to the very physical TMS. OCD operates on the same psychological imperative as anatomical TMS symptoms, but in this case, the imperative is conscious (and extremely annoying for the patient). OCD is actually rather easy to beat, but you must be resolute. It is important to convince yourself that the rituals are indeed not only meaningless, but also self-perpetuating. Bite the bullet and get used to purposefully NOT doing them. This is the same advice often offered in Sarno's book for physical symptoms which bring on symptoms, such as sitting, running, etc. If you know a behavior will challenge the condition, do it on purpose and scoff at it. This will set the precedent that nothing dire will happen without the ritual. Sounds easy and it is. You just have to actually do it and not give in...
CURE-BACK-PAIN(dot)ORG |
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skizzik
USA
783 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 17:18:31
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good reply by sensi, I was a door lock checker, and you know your'e one when you've broken/loosened many doorknob/carhandles. Over time (a decade perhaps?)I would bring my ritual down to 3 turns, or pulls and convince myself that was enuff. Eventually, I could pull the door shut and as long as I payed a lot of attention in that timeframe to what I was doing I could convince myself it was enuff, and could reason w/ the urge to re-check it as I drove down the street. Then I would reason whats the worst, someone could break in. So what. Break ins happen when you least expect it. So as long as you expect a break in, your'e statistically fine . |
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Littlebird
USA
391 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 17:47:46
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| Both Sensei and Skizzik make good points. We can change the patterns in our brains by doing a Sensei says and choosing not to check again. And Skizzik's point about break-ins being a statistical part of life shows that we really can't control everything, even with constant vigilance. We can learn to be satisfied with a reasonable level of caution and stop the exhausting habit of obsessing. Having homeowners' or renters' insurance is also reassuring. A few hundred dollars a year has done wonders for my obsessing, though I still get an occasional urge to triple-check and have to remind myself it's pointless after the first time. |
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Shary
147 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 18:13:51
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Art, I wish I had a dollar for every time I've driven around the block to make sure I'd shut the garage door. Once I even went around the block TWICE because I'd gotten sidetracked by something the first time around and forgot to look.
I think this sort of thing is probably fairly normal. It's usually a case of being preoccupied while doing something so habitual that it's automatic--and then not remembering whether you did it. Is that OCD? Probably not. I've chalked it up as being out to lunch. |
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jst
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 18:34:57
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Here's the thing: you want to be safe, so you check your doors and toilets. The thing is, you know that you have taken things TOO far, and that's why you're posting on this site. So how do you do things with appropriate, and not excessive, caution?
I think you have to trust your body. You have to trust that deep down inside, your body knows how cautious it should be, given all the risk factors and risks/rewards of being cautious but not too cautious.
I don't think you should just try to STOP CHECKING. You've tried that before. It won't work.
You won't stop being overly cautious until you realize that all of the excess number of times that you cautiously check your door, toilets, etc., are examples of OCD behavior that your body uses, like physical pain, to distract you from painful emotions buried deep with your soul. Whatever they relate to - work, love life, family, friends, etc - these emotions are frightening to face.
But as long as you feel like you're being overly cautious and displaying OCD behavior, then your brain is using this unusual behavior to distract you from underlying emotions thoughts and feelings that it decided were somehow just too painful to face.
So don't just say to yourself: "STOP CHECKING THE DOORS/TOILETS!" Instead, ASK yourself what you might be feeling that your brain might've decided was too painful to face. Just keep asking that question. Never stop. As long as you ask that question, you'll eventually come to terms and face whatever your brain decided was too harmful to really acknowledge, and you'll come to peace with your garage doors, car doors, and toilets. |
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electraglideman
USA
162 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 20:58:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Shary
Art, I wish I had a dollar for every time I've driven around the block to make sure I'd shut the garage door. Once I even went around the block TWICE because I'd gotten sidetracked by something the first time around and forgot to look.
I think this sort of thing is probably fairly normal. It's usually a case of being preoccupied while doing something so habitual that it's automatic--and then not remembering whether you did it. Is that OCD? Probably not. I've chalked it up as being out to lunch.
If thats OCD, I've got it. |
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weatherman
USA
184 Posts |
Posted - 05/06/2007 : 23:23:32
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I can relate to all of this, my big one is worrying that I forgot to turn off the stove in the morning.
I also wonder where exercise crosses into the realm of OCD, because I sure don't feel right when I don't get any - even for one day. I will go to great lengths juggling and rearranging other obligations to make sure the daily exercise happens. If all else fails I'll go walk up a nearby hill at 1AM, even to the point of sacrificing sleep, just to "feel right".
I was once told that I had a depressive personality, and that I probably was an aerobic exercise fanatic because it was the only time I felt as good as other people do "normally" due to the endorphin rush etc. It was food for thought. Reminds me of the saying that an optimist is someone who believes this is the best of all possible worlds, and a pessimist is someone who's afraid the optimist is right.
Apparently OCD, depression and TMS are all very intertwined, and hard to separate from one another - but I'm convinced they all have some fundamental thing in common.
Weatherman
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jst
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 00:40:20
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Weatherman, how bout this idea: the fundamental thing they have in common is that they are ALL techniques that your brain unconsciously employs to DISTRACT you from emotions that, for whatever reason, were deemed too hard to face up to in some way?
So only by asking yourself what thoughts and/or emotions your brain might use exercising to distract you from can you break free from the excessiveness of your exercise and begin to exercise in a healthy, unexcessive way.
Thoughts? I'm starting to really believe this. |
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Singer_Artist
USA
1516 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 06:56:31
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Hi Art,
I have done the going back to the house and checking the garage b4, as Shary speaks of..So I believe there are varying degrees of this tendency..I have a dear friend of many years from NJ who has OCD so bad he had to go inpatient for a time..They used primarily behavioral modification and meds..I think in your case, it just the TMS gremlin looking for another distraction, the old symptom imperative!
You are a strong willed man with alot of discipline! I believe you can lick this thing more easily then you think..Perhaps try to check just once, and when you do, make it a point to be 100 percent focused and mindful in that moment..take a deep breathe and leave the house in peace..
Hugs,
Karen |
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Shary
147 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 08:59:48
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I have to agree that this is probably a trait of TMS-prone personality types. We tend to be worriers and checkers. It might also be a learned trait to some extent. My mother was a checker and so is my daughter. I have a friend whose toilet ran for an entire six weeks while she was in Italy. It didn't overflow but she ended up with a $500 water bill. Since then, if I'm going to be gone for more than a few hours, I listen for the toilets before I go out the door. This is just common sense.
If I don't remember whether I closed the garage door, I will go back and look because I know it'll bug me if I don't. To me this is no biggie so why make myself uneasy by challenging it? I should point out that there's a difference between doing something automatically and not remembering if you did it and, say, deliberately washing your hands a hundred times a day, fully aware that you are doing so. People who have OCD probably know they have it. The rest of us are just absentminded. |
Edited by - Shary on 05/07/2007 09:00:50 |
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sonora sky
USA
181 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 11:52:07
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I think you have to get at the root of the fear that is causing the compulsive behavior. Simply forcing yourself NOT to check the locks and be on your way, for example, might not get to the heart of things. While it may break that particular habit, the mind will soon find another outlet on which to displace the fear.
I wonder if, when you felt the urge to check locks on the way out, you paused and did some psychological/emotional searching, a la Sarno. Try to find out what fear is causing you to compulsively perform these acts. What might happen if the doors went unlocked? (I'm sure many possibilities come up; my mind would go wild with this question.) Take each scenario to its extreme end (aka the snowball effect). (Art, I see a link between this thread and your recent one about disasterous/horrible images popping into your mind throughout the day. This happens to me a lot, and it usually conderns deep-seeded fears of loss.) For me, I would immediately think of a break-in. The thought of people rummaging through the house and stealing our stuff would be quickly surpassed by a much greater threat: that these people would find my pet and torture her to death. At this thought, I would immediately start to cry and then become enraged, not because this event that I've thought up might occur, but at the people in our world who do such things, and at Evil on a grand scale. Then I would spiral into feelings of helplessness and hopelessness that our planet is doomed and there's nothing I can do to stop it. (Sorry if that seemed a bit of a jump to you guys, but my mind works fast.) So, for me, checking the locks feeds into my general fear of loss (could I survive it? how would I cope?) as well as my fear of losing control (despite the locks, am I ever really safe? Can I prevent my own death or the death of others?).
Now, once you get to this stage, I'm not sure how to proceed. Identifying the fears may be enough; holding them in your awareness, feeling them deeply, and then letting them go when you are ready may be effective. These fears tend to overwhelm me, I think because I have not yet learned how to let them go; they cling and I ruminate, which ultimately perpetuates the fear and keeps me frozen. Any suggestions?
ss |
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carbar
USA
227 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 19:51:53
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I used to think that OCD was a TMS equiv ONLY but now I have anecdotal evidence that it isn't. ;) how scientific.
Recently, though, I met a 3 year old kid with the tendencies of OCD. He gets all emotional and obsessive about the texture of his clothes and food, whether his shoe lace is tied tightly enough, etc. So, I'm thinking that there must be some kind of wiring/chemistry to it if this behavior can affect someone so young.
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wrldtrv
666 Posts |
Posted - 05/07/2007 : 23:52:01
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| Art--I'm reading a book called, "The Mind and the Brain: Neuroplasticity and the Power of Mental Force." The author, Jeffrey Schwartz MD, who also wrote "Brain Lock", created a novel method of fighting OCD. The old method is simply resisting the OCD urges. A much more successful approach is to add some other important steps. The first is to recognize the obsession at its first beckoning. This is mindfulness. Second, is to relabel it, so it's not, "I'd better wash my hands again because they are full of germs" but, "Oh, that's my OCD acting up again..." Third, refrain from acting on the compulsion, but at the same time do something pleasurable or something that will capture your attention. The idea is that, practiced over and over each time the obsession arises, the obsession will weaken, as it has to compete with the new, healthier thought or activity. A new neural pathway will have been created (neuroplasticity). |
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mikescott_98
USA
49 Posts |
Posted - 05/08/2007 : 05:59:15
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My wife is this type of "checker". She has me double and triple check that her hair straightener is unplugged every time she leaves the house.
I have mentioned before that I found out about Dr. Sarno through the unusual source of Howard Stern's book "Miss America". He had had terrible back pain and OCD. His OCD was so bad that it was cured BEFORE the back pain, and the side effect was that his back pain became the most excruciating it had ever been....and he was the happy because he longer had the OCD. He did not care how bad his back hurt as long as he did not have to turn the lights on and off 32 times when he left the room (I might be wrong on what his OCD act was, but it was something similar to that). Soon after his OCD was cured his back pain went away. |
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armchairlinguist
USA
1397 Posts |
Posted - 05/08/2007 : 08:57:29
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carbar, I don't think that your example is really evidence for OCD not being TMS. TMS issues can stem from things we experienced as infants or very small children, or from personality traits (which may be inborn). Kids do get TMS -- I think Sarno says usually in the form of stomachaches and headaches associated with activities they don't like, but sometimes in other forms, presumably.
Also, those may not be OCD qualities, though it's hard to tell. But the kid could just be sensitive or going through a phase, or could also have autistic tendencies -- some autistic spectrum kids have OCD-like rituals or particular sensitivities.
--
Wherever you go, there you are. |
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tennis tom
USA
4749 Posts |
Posted - 05/08/2007 : 10:40:32
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quote:
Originally posted by carbar
I used to think that OCD was a TMS equiv ONLY but now I have anecdotal evidence that it isn't. ;) how scientific.
Recently, though, I met a 3 year old kid with the tendencies of OCD. He gets all emotional and obsessive about the texture of his clothes and food, whether his shoe lace is tied tightly enough, etc. So, I'm thinking that there must be some kind of wiring/chemistry to it if this behavior can affect someone so young.
Nine months in the womb may be a very TMS creating environment. One is in a dark, lonely place, without a cell-phone, totaly dependent on someone, one has never been formaly introduced to. Perhaps the womb is the original TMS reservoir of rage.
Whoever came up with the notion, that the womb was some Nirvana or Garden of Eden, probably doesn't remember what it was like, and should do a re-birthing workshop.
some of my favorite excerpts from 'TDM' : http://www.tmshelp.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2605
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Edited by - tennis tom on 05/09/2007 08:44:17 |
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marytabby
USA
545 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 06:25:47
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| I don't have any form of OCD but I do find myself double checking the lock on the front door or making sure the coffee pot if unplugged. If I can't clearly remember locking it (which I have never forgotten to do) I will go back and check it. I have even driven a few exits past my house and turned around because I couldn't remember locking the door or unplugging the coffee maker. I think these are normal behaviors. If however I were doing it over and over, well then I'd say it's OCD. What others said probably would work for you: bite the bullet, ignore your temptation to check everything. |
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 06:57:35
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OCD is most definetly a TMS equivalent when you understand the pyschololgy behind TMS and OCD. You cannot make a definitive statement based on one single case.
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Sarno-ize it!
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art
1903 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 07:22:07
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Thanks to all...I'm actually amazed how many other's have this. It's interesting to see that some (mary) even consider this normal. I suppose one quick double check isn't a problem, but I'll often check 2 or 3 times. I'll go to check, then get sidetracked and thus not create the memory of checking that I seem to need in order to relax. If I can picture looking at the burners of the stove and noticing that they're all off, I'm ok. If not, then I worry and will usually check again.
Sonora, I think you touched on it. For me, it's symptomatic of feeling a lack of control over things in a violent and uncaring universe. I don't seem to have the sense of personal safety that many "normal" people seem to have. I'm keenly aware of the fragility of life, especially my own and my loved ones. I never go on a long car ride for example without contemplating the possibility of a fatal accident. And I never leave the house without thinking about the possibility of a fire that kills my dogs..
I have a hard time thinking of this as TMS. It feels more basic than that, an expression of the fear all human beings have, consciously or not, of pain and death. It seems to me that the older I get, the thinner does that protective veil of feeling safe in the world become. When I was a kid, I felt immortal. In my mid-50's, I feel anything but.. |
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shawnsmith
Czech Republic
2048 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2007 : 07:35:35
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Checking 3 times is not OCD. Checking 50 times is another story.
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Sarno-ize it!
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OCD
